Here’s my interview with Ryan Cole, Vice President of Video Technology at Cosm, that was conducted on Wednesday, June 11, 2025 at Augmented World Expo in Long Beach, CA. See more context in the rough transcript below.
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Rough Transcript
[00:00:05.458] Kent Bye: The Voices of VR Podcast. Hello, my name is Kent Bye, and welcome to the Voices of VR Podcast. It's a podcast that looks at the structures and forms of immersive storytelling and the future of spatial computing. You can support the podcast at patreon.com slash voicesofvr. So, containing my series of looking at AWE past and present, while I was at AWE, I had a chance to go off-site to Cosm, which is like the immersive dome podcast. You can think of the sphere, which is like 18,000, 19,000 people that have seats to see this giant dome. Well, Cosm is kind of like a mini sphere. It's like more of the order of like 1500 to 1800 or so. So it's much smaller, which allows them to do a lot more experimental type of content, a lot more narrative content, but they've also been doing more like live sports events. And when I went there last year during the Snap Partners Summit, I saw the Cirque du Soleil O piece, which you know it's sort of like capturing a theatrical performance but it's a lot different than actually being there and seeing the live performance and so i wanted to really see like a live sports event there because i feel like that's kind of like a sweet spot for a place like this they call it shared reality where you have like people in the similar type of immersive experience together it feels like you're seeing a vr experience but you don't have the vr headset and you're not limited by the limited field of view of 90 to a hundred degrees of most VR headsets and that you have much wider field of view that goes into like almost 180 degrees in some situations, depending on the experience that you're doing. And so while I was in LA, the NBA finals were happening and I'm from Indianapolis and I'm a huge Pacers fan, or I guess more of a fair weather Pacers fan, but it was super exciting to watch the Pacers go through the NBA finals this year because they were doing all these like super improbable wins, like coming back and winning when they weren't expected to, basically defying all the odds. They didn't end up winning the series they lost in the seventh game, but... it was an amazing run and the game three was happening and they were back in Cambridge field house in Indianapolis. And so it was sort of like a pseudo home game, but I was in Los Angeles watching it. And so I wanted to go and check it out. And I, and I got the tickets, you know, the tickets for actually going to the game would be like in the hundreds, thousands, tens of thousands of dollars. And so you kind of get the best seats from, you know, courtside seats. And then like, you're end up being like on the end of the court. So you're kind of watching the, a straight on view rather than from the sidelines and then there's like a higher up view so there's like basically four different cameras four different views and what i noticed is that they're cutting between those different angles and whenever they're cutting it sort of weakened my sense of actually being there it is very immersive where it feels like oh i feel like i'm at this game but there are certain things that they'll do the cutting and then like it reminds me oh yeah you're an immediate experience and then during the intermissions and breaks they weren't feeding in the audio of what it would sound like to being there they cut in and play some music and other things so there's certain things that they were doing in a way that made me feel less present of actually being there. But I think they're trying to, you know, create this kind of hybrid experience, but also focus on, you know, what is it like for you to kind of actually be there with other people? So the way that they have the booths are kind of more like you're sitting in a booth in a way that Uh, sometimes you're awkwardly sitting, like not facing the screen, but more facing in a U. And so you kind of have to turn your head or body to see the screen. And so there's like little things like that where, you know, if you're just optimizing for watching the experience, then, you know, you may have made some different design choices, but they're really trying to create this kind of group collective experience. And then afterwards I had a chance to check out some of their other narrative content. And I caught a double feature of a psychedelic mixtape, as well as liquid verse, which were showing different ways of having more of these artistic or music types of experiences where it's a little bit different than actually just like watching a 360 video. Again, the full immersion gives it a little bit different quality and you don't have like the depth of field. So you end up kind of having what you would imagine in a VR experience as like something being on a skybox, but yeah, If you just imagine like having like doubled a field of view, then you feel even more immersed into the visuals. And yeah, the liquid verse was really quite interesting because there was no special effects. It was actually like super close up of this kind of organic melding types of shapes. And so that was interesting just because you have such a large huge screen to see and you want to see like novelty or interesting things and so having these kind of organic shapes and not really using too much computer graphics where you have to kind of design all that novelty you're getting it for free with doing these kind of organic types of physical based media production something like liquid verse and then the Psychedelic Mixtape was doing a little bit more of like kaleidoscopic kind of like putting cameras and lights and mirrors and creating these other types of novel experiences with both of them very much driven by the music background as well. So it's kind of a very interesting thing that they're doing there with other arts and entertainment and being a little bit more experimental with what types of independent artists or pieces that they can try out there. But really, I think the bread and butter for where I think they have a super compelling use case are these live sports events. And so I had a chance to, during the halftime of the NBA finals, talk to Ryan Cole, who's the VP of video technology. And so he's involved with helping to produce all these different types of of live sporting events from like the Kentucky Derby to WWE to UFC to NBA Finals, Stanley Cup, and they had like the World Series. And so basically like all the different sports and college football in that season. And so I had a chance just to talk to Ryan about their process of creating and producing some of these live sports events. And the other thing that I didn't get a chance to see, unfortunately, was this kind of immersive translation of the matrix. And so what they end up doing is creating a 16 by nine frame in the middle of the dome. And then in that other part of the dome, they create what's a little bit more of an environmental, like being transported into the room and having other different types of lighting effects that are happening there. And so creating like more of an immersive type of experience to this movie that we all know and love, The Matrix. And, you know, having this other value add that has been wildly popular. It seems like people are really, I see a lot of buzz around people seeing it and really being quite impressed and blown away. So that was interesting. Put together by Little Cinema, and there's an episode on No Presidium Podcast that goes into a little bit more. So I got to see the trailer. The trailer was really cool, and I really wish I had the opportunity to see the whole thing. But unfortunately, it just didn't work out to go back in the middle of the day while I was there at Augmented World Expo, since this was my only field trip into an immersive kind of expedition experience. So anyway, that's what we're covering on today's episode of Voices of VR podcast. So this interview with Ryan happened on Wednesday, June 11th at a site visit to Cosm in Los Angeles, California. So with that, let's go ahead and dive right in.
[00:06:46.637] Ryan Cole: I'm Ryan Cole and I'm the VP of video technology here at Cosm. I manage anything from distribution, from capture distribution at our Cosm events across the world.
[00:06:57.694] Kent Bye: Maybe you could give a bit more context as to your background and your journey into the space.
[00:07:01.255] Ryan Cole: Sure. I actually have a very broad esports background. So I had 16 years in esports, and it translated very well into this immersive space. I wasn't in immersive to start. And as I started carrying on and started working towards the immersive content that we're producing right now, I started seeing that there needed to be a shift in some of the mentality and some of the approaches of how we look at the technology to scale it effectively, not just for our domes, but our other partners and other things that we're doing across the ecosystem.
[00:07:27.406] Kent Bye: OK. And so maybe you could tell the story of how you came across Cosm and transitioned into doing what you're doing now.
[00:07:33.148] Ryan Cole: Sure. Awesome. That was an interesting conversation. At the very beginning, Jeb and Devin, our CEO and CTO, actually were very interested in the nature of the esports ecosystem and wanted to see how events were produced at this kind of scale in the capacity for fandom, especially with relation to esports, mainly because fandom is created really globally there, and you can actually create a lot of content around that stuff. And so we had conversations and we kind of grew from there. But as they told me the challenges that they faced ahead and what they wanted to do, I was very intrigued. I mean, again, something I had never done before, but I have a very interested mind towards bleeding-ish technology. And so I consistently focused on that to really, you know, leave the charge for what we're doing right now.
[00:08:13.220] Kent Bye: So I've had a chance to see the O from Cirque du Soleil and, you know, I've talked to Neil and Katie about more of the arts and entertainment side, but talk a bit about the sports side and kind of developing this in terms of the, what you're streaming, where did you start? And yeah, I'd just love to hear how the live moment of a sports event and bringing that into this dome experience.
[00:08:32.037] Ryan Cole: Sure. There's a lot that goes into it for sure. What we end up doing to really start is take our technology out to the venues across the world. We have 10 production kits that we send out globally. You name it across multiple leagues, partnerships that we have. We have kits out in the UK. We're doing a Premier League when we're up and running for that. But Those 10 production kits go out. We have four people on site. We have a production manager, two camera techs, and an engineer that are out there. So very agile footprint. And then we have a Remy facility back here in Playa Vista at our offices in Playa Vista. And we actually remote into that system and we produce the entire show. And then from there, we actually encode the... Sorry, that came up really loud. We encode the nature of our content. We send it to the cloud and we pull it down in our domes. OK.
[00:09:17.846] Kent Bye: And then, so can you talk a bit about what's the approximate resolution? Is it 8K, 16K? And frame rate in terms of is it 30 frames per second, 60 frames per second? Just trying to get a sense of the specs.
[00:09:30.697] Ryan Cole: Sure. So the dome itself is a 12K resolution. However, the content that we produce, it's 8K 60. So we're actually taking anywhere from four to six cameras live to our facilities. And what you'll see is you see the cap and canopy that's over it. It kind of fully wraps around you and above you. We put the 8K immersive feed basically in front of you, but we utilize the cap and canopy to do a lot more things in the environment. So you can see during the show, we do triggers and things of that nature where, you know, when the pacers are, you know, they sink a basket, we can trigger that in the inverse environment as well. So there's a lot of things that go into it, but the resolution itself from the camera to distribution point, is 8K60, we're working on making that better as the years come, too, as well.
[00:10:08.409] Kent Bye: And so I feel like watching the NBA finals game three tonight with the Indiana Pacers, I'm from Indiana, so this is a bit of a special event for me to be able to see this live sports event. And so it feels like with basketball you have Courtside seats you have something's a little bit higher and then you have with the court ends with the two different shots And there's a bit of like cutting in between those shots But also, you know, you're you're having the live broadcast being beamed in in terms of the audio that we're getting from them so I'm noticing like Sometimes courtside seats, I see somebody who's blocking. The coaches are standing there, and it feels like this is actually what it would be like if you're there. And so there's a bit of sometimes things being occluded based upon referees or other things standing there, and you have to cut between. So yeah, I'm just wondering if you could talk around the strategy of trying to figure out the optimal viewpoints and then trying to make it so that sometimes I just want to see one view, but then sometimes those views get occluded. And so you're trying to show the best shot, So there's a little bit of a trade off between like feeling somewhat disoriented with the dome versus like being completely immersed in a singular perspective. So just curious how you kind of navigate those different trade offs as you're producing these live events.
[00:11:16.215] Ryan Cole: Yeah. So that's a very interesting question. And that goes it's very different for multiple sports, right? The biggest thing for the NBA, when you're actually looking at it the way that you're sitting in the dome and experiencing it, we want to make sure that you're fully immersed in the content. We also want to make sure that you have the best seat in the house no matter what. Right. So as we continue moving in that content, we want you to see different aspects of where you would be if we gave you that best seat in the house, right? On top of it, you know, just like you said, the occlusions that are there, we want to make sure that you're not hindered by that, right? If somebody's standing in front of the camera and you can't see the nature of the content, we want to make sure you're changing the environment. But we also don't want to cut so fast that it's disorienting, right? So we're very methodical about that. It's the same thing as if you were cutting a VR show. So actually a lot of the technique that we bring into the dome actually kind of originated in some of that transpired from VR production. So, you know, we started building in headset a lot of what we wanted to do and we knew cut timings were disorienting after a certain period of time, right? And so we wanted to make sure that we were positioning the cameras in the right way to give you the best seat in the house, but also make sure that you feel a part of the atmosphere. And that was really important for us. As well as bringing in the broadcast feed, we're kind of giving you a special pairing of things that you wouldn't normally get in the venue, right? Additionally, we do some additional stuff here at the venue in our domes where we provide different experiences during commercial breaks and things of that nature too. T-shirt cannons, we have MCs and things of that nature as well. And so we want to make sure that we're catering to the experience more than anything else.
[00:12:40.584] Kent Bye: One question around when there's a break, I noticed that you'll often play your own custom music over it rather than playing what's happening in the stadium. Just curious, the decision that you make in terms of taking control over the virtual audio production of that versus creating this feeling of being completely immersed in the place and hearing what you would hear if you were actually there.
[00:12:58.513] Ryan Cole: Yeah, that plays into whichever sport we're doing. Sometimes it depends on the nature of what we have access to and what's going on in the stadium. Other times, it's really creating a different environment, a unique experience to cause them, right? Not just the nature of the experience that's happening at the venue, but how can we level up here? Like, we also level up food and beverage and everything like that here as well. So we want to make sure we're leveling that experience up. It depends on the event, what we're doing. Sometimes during halftime, you might see, you know, the dog who's playing basketball out on the... but sometimes we'll do some of our own stuff here as well, like show you some upcoming things here at Cosmo and things of that nature. We want to make sure that we're providing the best of both worlds and showcasing what you can experience here just in the NBA game itself, but also what else we can provide here.
[00:13:41.499] Kent Bye: Yeah, I saw O, the Cirque du Soleil piece, and I thought, you know, I want to really check out a live sports event, because I really think that this is a sweet spot of Cosmo, is seeing the live sports. And after watching the first half of the NBA Finals Game 3, I can definitely say that there's a different energy. It's very exciting, and it feels like it's a very good fit. The thing I was really surprised at, from the courtside perspective, I could actually see the entirety of the court. And if I was in a VR headset, I would only have a 90-degree field of view. So it was actually having a VR type of experience, but having an ultra-wide field of view and being able to see the entirety of what I would normally see if I were there. So it feels like it's very immersive and feels like it translates this conceit of live sports and being able to bring it to fans of the teams that may not be there to be able to watch these things. So yeah, just to hear some of the reactions that we've had from fans watching these different events.
[00:14:30.984] Ryan Cole: Definitely. I think one of the biggest things for me and what's really special about Cozum and our venues is we're creating a different type of fandom. I think you still have the fandom from the live venues that you would go to seeing a normal show, but we're bringing people together in their respective cities. We're bringing people from other cities to come in and experience the content too. So the fandom is really leveled up. When you actually can bring people together, we call it shared reality, bringing people together and experiencing both the best of the virtual and the physical world together with leveled up food and beverage and experiences, we feel like we're creating a sense of fandom that you wouldn't get in other places. And we're also bringing people together. We're transporting them to other places around the world that they may never get to in their entire life, right? And that's a really, really unique experience that I don't think you can really translate unless you're here and experience it for yourself. especially in the 180 view, right? So being able to be fully immersed and seeing the entirety of the court makes a big difference than being in VR headsets sometimes.
[00:15:24.790] Kent Bye: Yeah, and also be able to watch the crowd and other things that aren't in their normal broadcast. I'd love to hear a little bit more around other types of live events that you've been doing here at Cosm.
[00:15:34.116] Ryan Cole: Sure. Yeah, so we do quite a lot of live events. And I'll give you a rundown of kind of how we do some of our programming. On any typical day, you'll have one to two events, live events going on. So imagine those 10 production kits going all around the world. They're constantly moving, constantly moving. So you'll have an NBA. So this week, like, for instance, the slate for this week, this last week, saturday we had wwe uh money in the bank we had a ufc event we're doing the stanley cup finals we're doing the nba finals we're doing the matrix we're doing our studio shows and so we're programming this content to make an experience for many different types of fans in their own respective realms if you could think of cosm and our dome as a canvas we want to cater to the experience but we want to make sure you get that best of both worlds the live experiences the theatricals and we think it makes a lot of sense to really jump into cosm as a whole but on the sports side We're working with the Premier League, we're working with NBC Sports, Fox Sports, CBS Sports, ESPN, you name it, we're constantly going in. And then leagues like the NBA, NFL, UFC, we're constantly focused on delivering on our goals of making, we're trying to be an extension of the content that you could see in those venues and those sporting venues. But also here at Cosm, it's really important for us to continue creating fandom and making sure that people can get the best in class content. right here in their home city if they want to.
[00:16:51.307] Kent Bye: Do you think that there's any one sport that translates particularly well to Cozum, or do you feel like the technology is kind of generalized enough so that it's basically the perspective of any fan at any sort of sport? So I'm just curious to hear some of your thoughts.
[00:17:04.171] Ryan Cole: Yeah, I actually think it's actually more generalized, like you mentioned. mainly because you can create fandom out of certain sports that you haven't seen before. For instance, for me, I had never been a UFC fan, but when I watched it in the dome and the over the cage view and actually feeling like you're in the cage with the players, like the athletes, you have a different experience that you can't get anywhere, not even at the stadium, right? And so for me, that was a visceral moment, right? And so there are a lot of fans in different aspects of sports that want to see a specific angle or want to feel like they're a part of something. or can't get courtside there, right? Some of those seats are very expensive seats, depending on the nature of, you know, the event and the type of event they're going to. But on top of it, you know, I feel like it's more generalized towards what the experience is for a specific fan, right? And I think we're creating more fans for different content as well. And I think you're going to start seeing that a little bit more as people catch more on to a lot of the content that we're producing. Our fan experience is barred on some of the best. We get some of the greatest reactions for things that people have never seen before but also different sporting events that they have never been to before and come back frequently like for instance we did the kentucky derby that was a major hit you know and these are things that you know i wouldn't have expected us to put on our dome but we did and sold out and a great experience right and so we're trying to consistently think about new entertaining concepts that could potentially be brought to cosm as an extension of an experience somewhere else
[00:18:29.761] Kent Bye: So you're also showing a shared reality version of The Matrix. So I'm just curious if you could say a few words around what that experience is like in terms of taking what is normally a 2D film, but then using the dome to kind of fill in the gaps for creating these contextual kind of world building that's happening to give you extra flavor for watching the film.
[00:18:47.438] Ryan Cole: So that's a good one. And the reason it's a good one is because I had never seen The Matrix before seeing it at Cosm. And that is insane, right? A lot of people would be like, what, what, what? Even the internal folks are like, what? Even went to a point where when we were testing content, I made sure that I wasn't here because I wanted to experience it for the first time here at Cosm. And what I could tell you about the experience is we don't manipulate anything in that 16.9, so to speak, of the traditional experience, right? But what we do do is level up the immersivity around Things that are happening in the environment, the action, you know, there's some small subtle things that will happen that will transpire that will make you feel like you're a part of the elements in the movie. And then also, like, there will be some really intense moments that will be leveled up even more based on what we've been able to do and accomplish with our partners at Warner Brothers and Little Cinema to do these things. It's been... incredible experience for me personally and I'm actually going to be watching again very soon so I would say we are leveling up the experience for that I think it's a transformative nature of immersive experiences and I think you're gonna see a lot more of that come to fruition for us mainly because we we think it provides a really interesting experience to level up some of the the small things and the big things that come with those movies and just you know 25 years worth of content that's there for The Matrix specifically, just the same movie over and over and over again, but doing it in a different way, in a different light, is a very interesting thing to do. And I never thought we would do it to start. Once I saw it, crazy, right? These are things like as we continue living on the bleeding edge, we're focused on what can we do next that'll level that up even more, right? And so these are very interesting experiences for me even in particular, but for our fans as well.
[00:20:29.300] Kent Bye: And finally, what do you think the ultimate potential of all these immersive technologies and shared reality might be and what it might be able to enable?
[00:20:37.870] Ryan Cole: I think it's going to enable a lot more people to experience content together. And when you think about experiences at home where you're watching things on TV and the couch, we say couch to Cosm in a lot of different ways, mainly because we want to make sure that people are being able to experience content with friends and family, but also like-minded fans in that experience. And I think VR, AR, XR, Cosm, you name it, shared reality, you name it, it's about bringing fans together. And I really think that that's going to change the future of how we consume content and really experience it with other people around us that are like-minded in this space.
[00:21:18.052] Kent Bye: Anything else left unsaid you'd like to say to the broader immersive community?
[00:21:21.556] Ryan Cole: Keep doing work in the immersive community. At the end of the day, we're always living on the bleeding edge here at Cosm. And those that are consistently focused on living on the bleeding edge will consistently win and consistently keep climbing and create better experiences for people out there that are transforming the way that we consume content.
[00:21:39.372] Kent Bye: Awesome. Ryan, thanks so much for joining me here on the podcast. And I have to say that coming to a live sports event is incredibly awe-inspiring and immersive. And I think if the Pacers end up winning, or even if they don't end up winning, it's certainly one of my peak sporting fan experiences that I've had in my life. So I just really appreciate coming here and seeing this intersection between the immersive media and live sports and what you've been able to create here is really special. So thanks again for joining me here on the podcast.
[00:22:03.029] Ryan Cole: Awesome. Thanks for having me, and thanks for coming. We're glad you're here.
[00:22:06.564] Kent Bye: Thanks again for listening to this episode of the voices of your podcast. And if you enjoy the podcast and please do spread the word, tell your friends and consider becoming a member of the Patreon. This is a, this is part of podcast. And so I do rely upon donations from people like yourself in order to continue to bring this coverage. So you can become a member and donate today at patreon.com slash voices of VR. Thanks for listening.
